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Troyzan on Understanding Brazilian Women on Survivor

What does Troyzan think about the behavior of Abi-Maria Gomes and the players of Survivor Philippines?

This is MY podcast

On Survivor One World, Troyzan Robertson didn’t go down without a fight up against a majority alliance looking to vote him out. Troyzan joins Rob Cesternino on a Thanksgiving Edition of Rob Has a Podcast to discuss the gameplay of the Survivor Philippines players.

Rob starts off by asking Troyzan about his polarizing reputation in the Survivor community where he is both beloved and hated by some fans of the show. Rob thinks that the reason for the two opinions of Troyzan are split between fans who love his never say die attitude and fans who were turned off my Troyzan’s reluctance to acknowledge the gameplay of Kim last season. Troy gives his thoughts on Rob’s assessment and says that he is always going to play hard but says there are reason’s why he won’t give Kim all the credit that some feel like deserves.

Turning to the current season, Rob wants to know if Troyzan thinks that Mike Skupin should’ve made the move to vote with Pete Yurkowski and Abi-Maria Gomes. Rob thinks that this was a very tough call but if it’s that close, it’s better to not make the move because there will be consequences that come with making this flip. Troy agrees that Mike didin’t have to make the move yet at this point in time.

Both Rob and Troyzan were bumpuzzled by the gameplay of Jonathan Penner on this week’s show. Mike and Lisa Whelchel attempted to bring Penner into the final 3 with them but Penner refused their invitation. Rob and Troy both felt like it was not only foolish to turn down an alliance invitation (usually a bad idea on Survivor) but especially considering his position at the bottom of the alliance. Rob thinks that this wasn’t a savvy move for a veteran player like Mike Skupin.

Rob wants to know Troyzan thinks about the behavior of Abi-Maria Gomes in the game and Jeff Probst’s assertion that there was a cultural divide that is causing her to have trouble communicating with the rest of the group. Troy says that he has worked with a lot of women from the countries of Columbia and Brazil and there is a difference in the culture and language such as at tribal council when Lisa said that Abi-Maria wasn’t as gracious as the other players. Rob doesn’t buy that as an excuse because when she is saying things about being done cooking but not done eating, that is NOT something that is being lost in translation.

During Tribal Council, Denise Stapley said that she doesn’t want a “bad player” like Abi-Maria to get to the final three this season.  Rob and Troyzan talk about why they don’t agree with Denise’s strategy to try and win the game.  Rob finds out from Troyzan what players he wanted to go to the final three of his season.

Troyzan answers a number of questions from the listeners of Rob Has a Podcast from Facebook including giving some more insight into what was the correct answer to the question that Troy asked Kim Spradlin at the final tribal council. Troy also discusses how he came into possession of Kim’s hidden immunity idol and why he ended up selling it on Ebay recently. Plus we’ll also find out why Troyzan rarely wears a shirt, whether Troyzan could potentially be Malcolm Freberg’s father and who Troyzan endorses for the upcoming Miss Survivor competition.

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Rob Cesternino

Rob Cesternino is a two-time Survivor player and reality TV aficionado. Rob gives his thoughts on his favorite Reality TV shows as the host of "Rob Has a Podcast" More From Rob Cesternino »

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  • I thought Spencer was from Token Cheese and not China?

    • Lindsey

      He was.

  • LosPollosHermanos

    Troyzan has explained this ‘secret’ before, I think he said it on RTVzone – he thinks that Kim was doing some talking to her alliance on the way to tribal council when Jay got booted (and Troyzan wasted his idol). You’re supposed to be quiet during that trip.

    If you remember that episode – Jay came up to Kim and told her about Troy’s idol before the trip to Tribal, and Kim had to do some last minute scrambling (sort of like the last minute scrambling this season when the boot changed from Skupin to Malcom to Jeff Kent).

    Anyways, Troyzan doesn’t think Kim had enough time to explain to people how to vote and that she did it in the van on the way to tribal.

    I think Troy is full of it, and even if it is true, who cares?

    • ChanningTaintum

      He’s been trying to re-write his Survivor history ever since he got sent to Ponderosa. I still think he’s a cool guy, and he’s entertaining and should be welcomed back for another season. But he’s never gotten over that boot. Love your name btw L.P.H.

    • I think he suspect the producers/cameraman told kim, or even probst getting her too much input of that nights vote.
      I get the point that jay told kim, but we would never know what happen on the trip, most of the tribal, and other factors that comes in play toward that decicion.

      Anyway, I like Troyzan. He’s a character you can at least root for at his season for a couple of episode. And I hope he’s back.

      • He’s delusional, if the producers were going to tell a player such information (which they wouldn’t), wouldn’t they tell it to someone other than the person dominating the game, so as to make the season go in more interesting a fashion? There’s no way that Kim dominating the season in such fashion is what the producers were wanting to happen, it makes for less interesting game play.

        Bottom line, Troyzan has and continues to act like a whiny baby over the fact that Kim is a far superior player to him, is arguably (for sure in my mind at least) the best player in the game’s history, and got him to make several bad moves such as getting him to vote out Jonas and Michael. She also got Jay to trust her more than he trusted him, as shown by Jay fatally telling Kim that Troyzan was playing his idol. Oh, and she won the fan favorite vote he was convinced that he was winning. He acts like a whiny little kid on this subject, which is unfortunate since it makes him look quite bad and unlikable.

        • the more unlinkeable and bad he is outside survivor, the more likely they’d give him another season.
          I just think that some episode of that season was fun because of him.

          And I hope Kim gets 2nd season that shows her better side. I get that she wins brilliantly, but I do think that somewhat because she was too lucky at times too.

          • Troyzan’s interesting enough. From an entertainment standpoint, I wouldn’t mind seeing him on again, even if its just to root against him, since he’s made himself so unlikable with his extremely arrogant behavior and bias.

            I don’t see luck coming much into it with Kim’s victory. The one big thing she lucked out on was the men giving up immunity. But then, we’ve seen plenty of tribes throw immunity in the past, which is what for all intents and purposes what the men did when you get down to it (for example, fellow winner Boston Rob just 2 seasons ago had the opposing tribe do it), so its not something I’d hold that much against her. Even if that hadn’t happened, I still see her doing really good and likely winning since Colton has shown how enamored he was with her, both in post game interviews and on this very podcast. Aside from that? All skill as far as I see.

          • damnbueno

            After the members switch, Kim’s alliance almost stayed 100% intact. That was pure luck. It enabled her to remain in a control position for the entire game.

            Sorry but there was no way that Kim planned that out and made the moves to make it happen. It was a HUGE stroke of good luck.

          • I don’t really see how relevant it is though, its not like her post-switch tribe ever went to tribal council where that was a factor. The other tribe did have a chance to vote out someone from Kim’s alliance and didn’t do so. And its not like she simply rode that initial alliance through that portion of the game, she made the cross-tribal alliance with Jay and Troy which paid off tremendously later when she got them to vote the other guys out.

          • damnbueno

            It’s totally relevant because if the switch had gone a different way, she might have been totally screwed.

            Suppose Kim had switched tribes instead of Alicia, and she only had Christina and Monica with her against Colton, Leif, Tarzan and Jonas? She didn’t have the same loyalty from those women as she did from Chelsea, Kat and Sabrina. Suddenly Kim has to deal with Colton and his irrational, emotional decisions. If Colton decides Kim is the strongest female player instead of Monica, she’s got a lot of scrambling to do just to stay in the game. She might have been voted out instead of Monica.

            Kim is an excellent player, but let’s be real about it. It was much easier to form a new alliance with level-headed players like Troyzan, Jay and Mike, than it was with hothead Colton, gender-loyal Jonas, crazy Tarzan, and totally unaware Leif.

            Kim was able to boot Jonas and Mike (taking control of the game) because nobody but her partners Chelsea and Sabrina knew how good she was at that point in the game. If she’d been separated from her loyal partners instead of Alicia, Kim would have to stand out as a good player much earlier in the game.

            Kim would also have been a bigger target to the men. There’s no way Troyzan and Jay trust her as much if she’s coming from the other tribe at the merge. Having that trust is how she was able to use those guys to boot Jonas and Mike. Also, her original partners would wonder if she was still loyal to them or to her new tribe — just as they did with Alicia and Christina. It wouldn’t have been nearly as easy for her to get the women the numbers edge. As it actually played out, Kim could operate from a position of strength and trust from start to finish — due in part, because of a stroke of good luck.

            To take it a step further, suppose Monica had stayed with Troyzan’s group instead of Kim. Monica was likely to expose Kim’s alliance to the guys in an effort to get herself into a more secure alliance. She was on the outside of the Kim/Chelsea/Sabrina/Alica/Kat group and knew it. Sealing a deal with the guys would have been her top priority.

            Everyone who has won the game has benefited from some degree of good luck. Some have had (or needed) a TON of it (Natalie, Jenna, Amber, Fabio) others only had a little (Yul, Kim, Earl, Boston Rob). There’s just no way around that conclusion. Nobody has ever won the game on pure skill.

          • Mike

            What you say about luck is definitely true, but some are pretty close to winning on pure skill. Todd (-Amanda’s tribal council meltdown), and Hatch (-Rudy losing final immunity that he probably wins 8/10 times at least) are two that are pretty close. But the two for me that are the closest (assuming you count ‘the cast’ as Boston Rob’s luck in Redemption Island, since otherwise he played a perfect game) are Tom, provided you, like me, give him credit for inducing Ian to quit, and Brian Heidik, since he completely controlled every aspect of the post-merge game down to dragging the one person he could beat every time on his back to the end. (But even if you assent to my premise that he could not have lost to Clay, you have the other tribe throwing that one immunity challenge which was pretty lucky assuming that they would have won if they did not throw it, which isn’t as clear cut as the odds being in Rudy’s favor on that final immunity in Borneo).
            As for Kim, the luck helped, sure, but I don’t know how much it really would have mattered, because she is simply that built to play Survivor (extremely social, strategic, tactical, athletic, charming, likable, and yet somehow gives off a non-threatening air to those around her… not exactly sure where the drawbacks begin), unlike the bitter, delusional Troyzan who doesn’t really have much aptitude for the game at all. Normally I’d have sympathy for Troy getting the terrible table draw when he FINALLY got cast after a million attempts and unfortunately ran into the ‘greatest of all tiiiiiiiiiiiiime,’ but it’s not like he’s got a high expected value on a random season anyway. (For an illustration of my point, if Britney did not have Dan Gheesling on BB14, she would have easily romped to a 7-0 victory, so I have some sympathy for Brit, whereas without Kim, I still don’t see Troyzan winning with his personality we’ve seen on and off the show, and his lack of ability to play the game effectively given how often he got snowed by Kim and Co. and how inept he was at turning people to his side).

          • damnbueno

            Yeah, Troyzan started losing votes as soon as he started claiming ownership of the island. Blatant arrogance will never convince anyone to give you a million bucks.

            I define Survivor good luck as something that happens that helps your ability to advance that has absolutely nothing to do with any planning, strategy, manipulation or physical accomplishment on your part.

            I see Hatch having a couple more strokes of good luck besides the one you mentioned. He was lucky nobody identified his voting block until well after the merge. Jenna L. didn’t figure it out until the final 8, which brings me to his next stroke of good luck. Hatch was most lucky that Dr. Sean was so committed to his “alphabetical voting system.” Because of Sean’s decision — which had nothing to do with Hatch — it guaranteed Hatch would know how to instruct his alliance to vote. It also guaranteed Sean would not join with Jenna’s tribe to force a tie. To me, that was the 2nd most important vote of the season — next to the Jury’s vote of course. He was also lucky everyone in his alliance had a name that began with a letter that appeared deep in the alphabet. If Sean had reached “r” Rich would have been a goner.

            Brian also had more good luck than you mentioned. Ted was furious at Brian when he left the game. But on the Ponderosa, Ted heard that Clay had made some racist statements, which pretty much sealed his vote for Brian. Now, I don’t know that Ted would ever have voted for Clay, but its possible his anger towards Brian would have grown by the time Jury questioning began. If Brian gave him the wrong answer, it might have been enough to make Clay a millionaire, depending on how impulsive Ted was. And he was an emotional player. Brian’s tribe was also lucky that Shii-Ann fell victim to the fake merge, which gave them the numbers edge, but that stroke of luck is probably neutralized by the fact that if there was a merge, Shii-Ann was gonna vote with Brian’s tribe anyway and boot Penny. But of course, Shii-Ann’s decision to defect had nothing to do with anyone on Chuay Gahn. Her decision was pure luck too.

            And Boston Rob himself said that he probably wouldn’t have won if he’d pulled the other buff on day 1. That was his biggest stroke of luck. But I also think he was lucky Russell left the game so soon — not because Russell could have beaten him, but because the Producers were terrified at the possibility of having BOTH of their returning players gone before the merge. As soon as Russell left, Idol clues started falling in Rob’s lap. I mean really, this is a guy who had no interest in looking for, or using an Idol in HvV and the first several days of R.I., then all of a sudden he gets 4 clues in a row?

          • Mike

            Well to be fair to Hatch on Keniff, Sean has always said ever since the show has aired that it was no coincidence that he was pursuing an alphabet based voting strategy when Sue, Richard, and Rudy just happened to be at the end of the alphabet. Maybe Sean’s using revisionist history, but I tend to trust his logic that he used the alphabet plan as a way to vote with the alliance whenever necessary while not having the jury get mad at him for it. With the game in its first season and no real understanding of how and why the jury would vote the way we know them to now, it’s not a bad thought process as a means to win the jury if you get there by not pissing anyone off, while still working with the alliance if they don’t have the necessary votes.
            As for the second Hatch luck on people not identifying his alliance, that one isn’t debatable to me. I’m not going to say Hatch was lucky that he leveled his competition. It was the first season, he was playing by the same rules as everyone else, but he took the game to level 1, while everyone else was still trolling around on level 0 until it was too late. If you call snowing his competition luck, then every blindside in Survivor is ‘luck.’
            As for Boston Rob, your pulling the right buff comment is well taken, but I do feel like he may be selling himself short. I don’t think he was drawing totally dead on the other tribe, but he certainly would not have steamrolled the game like he did on his tribe. Rob tends to be pretty good at forming majority alliances in his tribes no matter who he’s with. Sure he got eliminated pre-jury twice, but only because of a tribe switch or the immunity idol, not his inability to get an alliance together. In four seasons, he’s four for four in creating a majority alliance in his original tribe.

          • damnbueno

            I hadn’t heard that about Sean, but if he wanted to work with Rich’s alliance without angering Jenna’s tribe, it doesn’t explain why he flat out told Rich he’d never join an alliance several times during the game. He seemed pretty committed to his “fairness” system, regardless of tribal loyalty.

            I’m not saying Rich keeping his alliance secret was pure luck, I’m saying he was lucky nobody on Jenna’s alliance figured it out until after two of them were gone. Rich had nothing to do with the 5 of them all choosing to vote for a different Tagi at the first post-merge vote. Someone should have woken up when Gretchen got 4 votes and everyone else except Greg (who had Immunity) had 1. Rich didn’t lull their brains to sleep with a master stroke of manipulation. That was pure luck.

            And any way you slice it, Rob’s Ometepe tribe was dumber than the Zapatera tribe. Geez, they wouldn’t even eat without Rob’s approval. His road would have been much tougher if he’d landed on Zapatera.

          • Mike

            Well sure it would have, hence why I just said “I don’t think he was drawing totally dead on the other tribe, but he
            certainly would not have steamrolled the game like he did on his tribe.” Not exactly a ringing endorsement.

            I get where you’re coming from on Rich, but I feel like saying that it’s lucky that they didn’t figure it out is coming at S1 from an S25 perspective. The reason I don’t see it as luck is not that it was a master stroke of manipulation, it was that they were all on a level playing field and he was the first person to level the game. I don’t see it as lucky that it took everyone else too long to catch up.

          • damnbueno

            Yeah, Rich was so far ahead of the others strategically it was almost unfair. But his advantage was almost neutralized by the fact that out of all the Jury members, he had the least competent social game next to Sue. He was smart enough to treat everyone with respect though.

            Rich had no clue about what factors would contribute to how the Jurors cast their votes. He got a pretty level-headed jury who voted on strategy, as opposed to emotion — except for Sue.

            When evaluating Survivor winners, you pretty much have to put Rich in his own category because he’s the only one who hadn’t seen the game played before, and didn’t know what to expect as he worked his way through.

          • Rei

            i think the men couldn’t have given up immunity if it wasn’t a “one world” concept. they lived on the same island and they could go over the other camp and say, “we give up immunity”.

            anyway, kim played a strong game. it’s just that luck is always involved. and the tribe swap was good to her.

          • to say Kim had no luck is silly. The cast was excellent for her, a bunch of men that could not get along, younger women who were very easy to manipulate, so to say there was no luck is stupid, every survivor winner has had an element of luck. That being said there is your argument, every winner has had some luck so Kim is no different in that regard.

      • LosPollosHermanos

        well you’re just conjecturing with the producer interference thing – he has never said that, plus I think he knows better than to expect that Survivor does that.

        Like I said – he said on RTVZone that he thinks Kim was talking in the van while they were supposed to be completely silent. We saw footage of Kim scrambling so I don’t know why Troy doesn’t think she had enough time to tell 2 or 3 people to switch their vote.

        Troyzan should be mad at JAY for blowing up his spot regarding the idol

    • And besides, if you listen to RHAP the vote has been changed mere minutes before Tribal on almost every season.

      • LosPollosHermanos

        When Troy mentioned it on RTVZone, Jerri laughed it off because people do it every season.

        • jerri laugh all the time though, :). man i miss rtvzone

  • LosPollosHermanos

    ‘Father Dan’ has used the religious persona to play an evil game on two seasons of Big Brother

    • This was who I thought of when they were discussing a fake priest character.

  • ChanningTaintum

    This is something I responded to on the 3Q’s with Probst on EW but can be directed towards Rob C and Troyzan pertaining to Denise wanting to play with strong players instead of bringing along a hated outcast……

    It’s usually fatal, but she put it out there right at tribal council, in front of the jurors. Think RC, Jeff, and Artis weren’t a little swayed by that?

    She put herself in an excellent position last night in front of everyone, and STILL isn’t considered a threat by the people she is aligned with.

    That was a Champion move. Only one left who is a risk to her and a million dollars now is Malcolm.

    • i get what your saying… BUT cant the opposite be said as well? Might they be offended/insulted by hearing such a statement? (i.e., we want to get the wastes out earlier and have only worthy players at the end… meanwhile, they’ve been removed from the game, inferring that they were not worthy of competing with the more formidable players at the end). it was a ridiculously stupid statement with ZERO upside… even if most of the people hate Abi (which is obvious) and she ends up on the jury (which is supposedly Denise’s plan), then you are guaranteeing you DONT get 3 votes (Abi, Pete, and Artis… Abi’s alliance)… its starting out with an already deep hole to dig out of assuming you make it to the end….
      trust me, I’ve loved Denise this entire season, she has been incredibly easy to cheer for thus far, but she had a very bad tribal council this past week. very dumb move to say what she said… again, zero upside.

      • ChanningTaintum

        Frank, thanks for the response, but I greatly disagree with your thoughts on this. RC and Jeff Kent were loving every minute of tribal, Artis is NOT going to vote for Skupin, and probably not for Lisa either (check what Pete says to Artis at Ponderosa) so that leaves Malcolm, Penner, or Denise. And I guess I don’t really understand how you think Denise had a bad TC, she was calm to Abi’s hysterics, endeared herself to the other players still playing (it was a sign of trust to her core group) and mentally broke a self-absorbed bully who might just end up voting for her anyway.

        It was pretty excellent for her, I thought. Mike wasn’t like by his tribemates, Lisa’s wishy-washy nature has not helped her one bit, Penner is already the odd man out, and Malcolm has the best chance outside of her, but he could be blindsided, or use the Idol prematurely, and get dropped at the 4-point.

        Hope I’m not missing anyone. =)

        • Very much agreed. She didn’t imply she was getting rid of the waste, as she did not vote for Jeff and had to vote for artis for obvious reasons, so I don’t see how she alienated any jury members. Now is this a winning strategy? maybe maybe not. As far as taking abi to the end you can’t. She’s not just a bad player who can’t win, she talks too much, everyone would know you’re taking her and turn on you. She’s not like a Natalie from Redemption island, who while bad knew to shut the f up and ride coattails.

          • damnbueno

            Denise’s statement can only backfire on her if any Jury members interpret her wrong.

            It seems clear to me that Denise was only referring to Abi-Maria as a bad player. But it’s possible that RC, Jeff and Artis could have thought “Is she talking about me? Does she think I could be easily beaten in the finals?”

            RC seems too preoccupied with blaming Pete, Artis and Abi-Maria for getting her booted to take Denise’s words as an insult, but Artis and Jeff aren’t. Jeff looks VERY bitter to me, and is looking for someone to blame. Denise might have just given him a reason to blame her. Artis could take it the wrong way too. And if someone else gets voted out before Abi-Maria (assuming she doesn’t win immunity), THAT person might think “If Denise voted for me, she must think I’m not a good player either.” Denise certainly decreased her chances of getting get Abi-Maria’s vote.

            While Denise’s statement was accurate and honest, it seems like an unnecessary risk to me. Downside — she may have given 3 or 4 jury members a reason not to like her. Upside — those in the finals with her (who won’t have a jury vote) will know Denise respects them. Or maybe some remaining players may think “Wow, that was ballsy of Denise to say what I’ve wanted to say about Abi-Maria for a while now.” But would that turn in to Jury votes? I don’t know. Abi-Maria could even look at Denise’s statement as a “moment of clarity,” and thank her for the revelation with a vote.

            I don’t think Denise was thinking about Jury management when she spoke up about Abi-Maria. It might have been better to give Probst a minmal, evasive answer.

          • ChanningTaintum

            Hi bueno, nice to see someone else join the discussion.

            I also feel that the members of the jury did not take it as a slight to them at all, it was very obvious she was speaking only of Abi.

            As his former teammate Lance Berkman once said after asked if Jeff Kent was racist “Jeff Kent isn’t racist, he hates everyone equally” =)

            With that said, one person who he actually respected out there on the island was Denise, he’s never had anything bad to say about her, so yeah, he’s bitter, but not towards her, she was on his side.

            I like what you said about Abi maybe having a moment of clarity, but this is Abi we’re talking about, so the chances of that are pretty slim. If Malcolm makes final 3, Abi votes for him. If he doesn’t make it, she has to make a tough choice, and we’ll see what she does when it gets to that point.

            As you can see, I am very confident they will send her on her way, maybe not this next TC, maybe not even the next, but she’s not making FTC. I just think if someone tries that tired move, it’s going to truly backfire on them at FTC.

            Malcolm is the real wild card in all of this though, he’s said as much himself, and knows he can be blindsided at any moment, so I don’t think he will hold a grudge towards them, he most likely will understand why the rest of them have to do what they have to do.

            And finally, I also agree with you, I don’t think Denise was thinking Jury management when she spoke up, but I do believe that was a pivotal moment of the season, and one that I think is going to pay off for her.

            If she makes FTC, she has a great case to present; she was on a decimated tribe, sent to a new one where she could have been voted out, she has been to every TC in the season and survived, she has been friendly, hard working, and a total gamer.

          • damnbueno

            Just curious, why do you think Abi-Maria is so sold on Malcolm?

            All we’ve seen of Abi-Maria’s decision-making process is that she thinks she’s smarter than she actually is. She thought she had secured Lisa and Skupin’s loyalty. She thought she was the one straightening Pete out on strategic decisions instead of the other way around.

            But she also thought Malcolm was loyal to her, and she’s fully aware that he betrayed her alliance by voting against Artis and Pete. She also believed RC betrayed her, and she hasn’t been forgiving to her at all.

            I think Abi-Maria looks at her situation as an “us vs them” thing, and Malcolm joined the “them” side when he voted for Artis. If she’s got a “Most hated” list if you will, she’d probably rank Skupin at #1, followed in order by Lisa & Malcolm (purely for betraying their vow of loyalty to her), then Denise (for the T.C. insult), then Penner & Carter tied for the bottom spot. But this is pure speculation of course.

            Abi-Maria seems to know what basic Survivor strategy is, she’s just woefully incompetent at the social game. I admit, I have no idea what criteria she’ll use to cast her vote. I think she’s equally likely to give her vote to the best strategist as she is to the player who can name any Brazillian soccer player not named Pele’. She might be totally emotional about it, and ask a “rats and snake” type of question that will make for a memorable moment. Or she could totally disappoint us with a show of growth and maturity like Alicia did last season.

            So why do you think Abi-Maria will vote for Malcolm — the guy who she might decide ignited her removal from the game with his vote for Artis?

          • ChanningTaintum

            Well she isn’t going to vote for Skupin or Lisa like you said, in her eyes they were acts of betrayal. She’s not going to vote for Penner because she just flat out does not like the man, she’s intimidated by him, and he flat out told her to her face that she wasn’t going to win anything, she despises him.

            She would vote for Carter over everybody, but seriously, he has as much of a chance of winning Survivor this season as you and I do. And that’s not meant to be totally harsh on the guy, but if he was going to the end, we’d be seeing a little bit more of him, and I seriously can not remember Probst asking him a single question at any tribal council, among many other things I won’t waste my time printing.

            So that leaves Malcolm and Denise. Malcolm flipped, sure, but he hasn’t been confrontational with her, he’s just kind of tolerated her, and stayed out of the way. Denise dressed her down pretty good, and Abi isn’t going to forget that anytime soon. So I picked the lesser of two evils, which is Malcolm.

            Of course, anything can happen over the next few episodes. But we’re at that point of the game where the picture becomes a lot clearer. Too bad certain blog writers don’t seem to see it, and decide to laugh off my comment on a podcast. =/

          • damnbueno

            I’m pretty obsessive with Survivor details, and for the life of me I don’t recall Penner telling Abi-Maria to her face that she couldn’t win. When did that happen? Are you sure he didn’t say that in a private confessional? If he did say it in a confessional, Abi-Maria has no reason to be mad at Penner.

            I agree that Carter’s edit doesn’t seem to fit a winner, but we all thought that about Fabio and Natalie too. I’ve learned not to rule out anything — except of course an Abi-Maria win.

            The Editors are well aware of how us superfans decipher their work and how it might telegraph the ending. There doesn’t seem to be a clear cut front runner this season (like Kim or Boston Rob), and I’m sure that’s by design.

            And as a general rule, I never eliminate the possibility of anybody putting their foot in their mouth when facing Jury questioning. It looked like Coach had it all wrapped up until he started answering the Jury’s questions.

          • ChanningTaintum

            Ohhh you just had to pull out your Coach card, didn’t ya! I expected him to win that one too, but wasn’t surprised, his head got HUGE leading up to the end, and the old Coach emerged.

            Penner told Abi she wasn’t going to win when her and Pete were scrambling for votes. This was right before the commercial break to Tribal.

          • She does have a reason to be angry at Penner, he voted for her. She seems to have let it slide, stunning really, but that is a reason whether it plays in or not.

          • I don’t think it was jury management but let’s break down the 3 jurors atm.

            RC – Believes she was taken out for being a threat as such I can’t see her having an issue with the statement

            Jeff – it would take a lot of revisionist history for him to take insult, he will over the course of Ponderosa know she did not vote for him, so I can’t see him taking offense.

            Artis – I could see Artis taking offense but that being said I haven’t been counting on him to vote for Denise anyways. His confessionals has lead me to the impression he’s most likely going to vote for Penner or Malcolm, not many scenarios involve Denise in a final 3 without 1 of them so not a vote for her.

            Like I said I don’t think it hurts, but I don’t think it really helps.

          • damnbueno

            I pretty much agree with you about those 3 Jurors. RC still has no idea how disliked she’d made herself. She can’t see herself as anything but lovable.

            I also think Kent knows Denise didn’t vote for him, but he looks so pissed off its possible he’d blame her for not pushing Skupin or Lisa harder to vote for Pete. Yes, Kent can be that much of a jerk. He was complaining about how all the others were playing defensively, while he wanted to play offense. He might call Denise a defensive player, and use her statement as a “safe, defensive move.”

            Artis does think Penner is running the show, but that could change. And don’t forget Pete. He could think Denise had lumped him in the “easy to beat” category because the decision to boot him was made before she made her statement.

            But most important to me is the revelation that Denise is capable of putting her foot in her mouth. She’s more fallible than we thought. Sometimes what separates the good players from the great ones (or winners from losers) is the ability to know what to say, and what NOT to say.

            Can you think of any bad statements Yul, Earl, Cirie, Sandra, Chris or Kim made that cost them votes? How many bad statements did Coach, Amanda, Russell, Stephen or Sash make that cost them votes?

            We just saw Denise make her first bad statement. She may have made more, but the Editors saw fit to show us this one, so it must have some significance.

          • I really can’t see Kent having that issue though as whoever she goes up against will have either voted for him, or be guilty of the safe thing.

            As for Pete, simply put he knows why he was voted off and can’t take it to heart. Abi was the target, she had the idol, he was her only ally left so the axe fell on him. Plus every time they talk about targeting pete (including at tribal) its generally about his strong qualities rather than a dead weight argument, like they hit abi with.

            That being said, it was an unnecessary statement and maybe it will bite her. I think it’s likely, I think she loses just because her finals plan involves Malcolm who I would not in a million years want to take to the final, he’s a good talker, seen as the bigger threat (both physical and strategically) and I don’t see how she beats that.

            Stephen I don’t think cost himself votes as an aside, thus a tad bit unfair to lump him in with that group. Simply put I can’t think of who wasn’t going to vote for JT heading into that final tribal, he’s the best player to get swept if that is any consolation, just went up against the last person anyone should have wanted to face that season.

          • damnbueno

            I’ve seen Jeff Kent at his douchbaggiest — twice — in a room full of sports writers. He is MORE than capable of going on an irrational rant ignited by a single statement he doesn’t like. We didn’t see this from him during Survivor because he was well aware that in order to win, the Jury had to WANT him to win, which meant he couldn’t be his insulting, douchebag self. He put on a “nice” game face.

            Neither of us are in Pete’s head. I remain open to the possibility that Denise’s statement, coupled with something else that may happen between now and the final T.C. could turn him against her.

            Being the biggest threat in the game and reaching the finals doesn’t always turn into a win. Just ask Colby, Boston Rob (All-Stars), Stephenie, Amanda (FvF), Russell, Sash, and Coach, all of whom lost the game with mistakes made down the stretch or under Jury questioning. A Malcolm appearance in the finals guarantees nothing. He still has to close it out.

            In Stephen’s opening Jury statement, he said his personal growth was the biggest in the game because since he wasn’t an outdoorsman, he had to outwit the others. Brendan took it as an insult and called him on it immediately. Stephen also lost votes and a ton of Jury respect when he hemmed and hawed at Debbie’s question “If you had won final immunity, would you have taken J.T. to the finals?” Stephen never picked up on the fact that the majority of his jury (Coach, Tyson, Sierra, Debbie) actually bought into Coach’s mantra and valued strong, physical players. He even told them that “hiding is sometimes a good strategy,” a statement that was greeted by a few shaking heads and/or rolling eyes.

            I don’t think Stephen could have beaten J.T. either. J.T. was a very believable liar that season. Taj was also more angry at Stephen for turning on her than she was when she found out J.T. wanted her out several times. But if Stephen had taken a different approach, maybe he loses 5-2 instead of 7-0. I think he had a decent shot at getting Taj, Erinn, and Brendan’s votes.

          • I disagree I think Stephen was in contention for just Erinn. Taj took her vote out more personally with Stephen since they had a close alliance and Brendan had one hell of a man crush on JT, I really don’t think Stephen was in play for their votes. The others you listed I think where in the driver’s seat whereas Stephen needed to mystify just to not get killed.

          • damnbueno

            I never picked up on any man crush Brendan had on J.T. If anything, he felt closer to Stephen because of the “secret alliance” they shared for a while. He didn’t strike me as bitter either, and even if he was, he was more angry with Coach and Tyson for his blindside than J.T. or Stephen. I don’t even think Brendan ever knew that Stephen voted for him while J.T. didn’t.

            Stephen’s biggest downfall was something he wasn’t capable of overcoming. He had the “nerd” image while playing with a Jury that preferred physical, tough players. Strategically, nobody could touch Stephen that season. But his image, and his less than stellar social game were too much to overcome. Stephen needed some street smarts to connect with this jury, but all he had was book smarts.

          • Brendan after a reward challenge was all over JT’s nuts, it was the most epic and random bromance this show has ever had, go back and watch it you’ll crack up.

          • damnbueno

            Well, if that’s true, its just one more reason Stephen had little chance of winning over that jury with book smarts.

  • its not about giving kim 100% credit its atleast give some credit

    • Didn’t you hear? Troyzan’s on the level of Richard Hatch. An amazing 8th placer like he shouldn’t feel obligated to give credit to people who actually won this game. A fan favorite like him doesn’t have to… oh, my bad, Kim won that too. ^_^

  • MickIsNotFeckless!

    A priest, a minister, and a rabbit walk into a game of survivor…

  • LosPollosHermanos

    Overall Troyzan was pretty good, better than expected.

  • Dave L

    Great interview. I like Troyzan… funny and “real”.

  • What happened to the final part of the interview? Troyzan’s sound got cut off, and we only get to hear you (Rob C.) say goodbye to Troyzan. Otherwise, great interview. Loved the jokes and backstory Troyzan gave on his season.

    • Maybe I cut it a hair short with the edit, but there was nothing else after that on the show.

      • LosPollosHermanos

        it ws just the last 60 seconds or so of your conversation with Troy – we heard your end but not his end of the convo

      • I do hate it when it happens, especially at the end. If Tyson did not get a proper edit I’m gonna abimaria over it.

  • Todd and Cochran definitely have to be on one of these Jeopardy episodes.

  • Amazing sound quality on Troyzan’s end. Probably the best I have heard from one of your guests who wasn’t sitting right next to you.

    • Anybody who uses skype and has a halfway decent mic is going to sound great. Sadly many of the reality stars that we talk to are not exactly on the cutting edge of technology… so Kudos to Troyzan.

  • My jaw is literally on the floor after that
    final 3 pact between Penner/Liza/Skupin, after all that greatness and
    brilliance display last episode, it all meltdown. Of all the people, he should’ve
    known that you must never say no to a deal, and he’s an actor, he should’ve at least
    put on a poker face, and agree with it.

  • i`m a brazilian woman and i can tell that is not a cultural problem, she is just crazy.

  • They said Dec 16 is the finale. If you do the numbers and if 1 person is eliminated per episode, then there’s a Final 4 in the Finale episode.

    The only “1 elimination finale” so far is Australian Outback. Everything else has 2 people eliminated in the finale.

    So F2 with 9 juries?

    • China only had elimination in the Finale as well. China was a Final 3 with a jury of 7. Philippines will prob. be a Final 3 with a Jury of 8 (prevents a 3 way tie). Probst has said a few times, except for the throwback season of Tocantins or Micronesia due to injuries, they were done with a Final 2.

  • Its too bad Troy is still bitter about losing survivor. On the bright side he is the best person at balancing balls.

  • Are you kidding me? I love Troyzan!It is always great to hear from a big fan like he is to talk about Survivor~!

  • Amanda Quist

    I listen to every podcast, but I might not make it through this one. Besides Kim, I’m just not interested in hearing from these One World cast members. Very thankful the Tyson cast will be coming to help balance this out!

  • Good podcast. I love Troy’s enthusiasm for the game. It’ll be interesting to see how he fares and how his game changes if he ever comes back.

  • Totally deserved on the nomination from Probst, if you don’t get in this year I will be shocked and appalled, you really are one of the all-time greats.


  • 1luckygrl

    I was never a big fan of Troyzan in the first place, but after this interview, I can honestly say, I don’t like him at all…On the bright side, I can’t wait for Tyson to be on the podcast again!!! :)

  • Troyzan… please stop insulting yourself by saying you are like the Oakland Raiders. you are embarrassing yourself. Still a fan… just sayin.

  • I liked Troyzan before he was on Survivor and I I liked Troyzan when he was on Survivor. But based on his post-Survivor interviews including this one, I’ve come to dislike him and I hope to never see him on Survivor again.

  • Tyler

    Troy is still bitter UGH

  • Murdock8

    It’s not cultural it is about how she was raised …

  • Murdock8

    Micronesia – Amanda and PArvati that was a strong final two …

  • Alex Keisler

    I can’t STAND Troyzan. First of all, he didn’t play the best survivor game ever, like he claims he did. He’s not the second coming of Richard Hatch like he thinks he is. He’s just a stupid, stubborn, arrogant, deluded person who refuses to admit that Kim creamed him. Plus, as if this isn’t enough, he cast a bitter jury vote for Sabrina. We all know it would have been a disaster if Sabrina had won over Kim. His vote for her pisses me off because he refused to acknowledge the best player.

    • umm did you listen? He states he’s not the second coming of Hatch nor did he play the best game. The bitter jury vote yes, he still doesn’t have a good reasons for that he is stubborn, he is arrogant, deluded is a bit of a maybe (deluded about survivor doesn’t = deluded as a person really) but please let’s not invent ammunition especially when there is so much.

  • Alex Keisler

    If Troy’s been getting a lot more positive than negative feedback than I’m clearly not doing my job.

  • avalyn2

    Not a Troyzan fan and didn’t find him enjoyable to listen to, I hope he doesn’t become a regular guest. He’s so arrogant and overly pleased with himself, you’d think he would have been in at least the final five with how much he goes on about how he was such a great character and how he appreciates comparisons to legendary players. He wasn’t very insightful here, mostly repeating stuff already said in the initial post-episode show. And I don’t like what seems to be his attitude towards women… I think I remember him a while ago boasting something like the girls on Survivor are nothing compared to the models he’s phootographed (What does it matter? Why is this relevant? Should we compare you to male models? I guess you don’t have to be since that is your privilege as a dude, whereas all girls have to be judged on their appearances, especially women on TV). His comments on Alicia and Lisa were also unnecessary and it’s irritating that he doesn’t give Kim any credit she deserves. In fact, it’s annoying to me that there are people in this thread describing about how lucky she is with detailed analysis, as if you couldn’t do that with any winner of Survivor.

    • The only time I describe in detail the luck of a winner is when someone is spouting off how they were not lucky. Every survivor winner to some level had luck, there is no exception to this and I don’t discredit Kim’s win. I just find it annoying people say there was no luck involved, I respond as I do to every winner when that comment is made.

  • Phillip Stanford

    Love Troyzan, Dan Gheesling did a podcast with him about how he got on to Survivor, very “inspirational” a great story missing the 3rd part though but he went through so much just to get on this show you have to love that dude

  • Troyzan wasn’t impressing me too much in the interview, but I LOVED watching him play one One World and would love to see him back on an All-Sar season in the future. It is rare to see someone throw all of themselves into the game. Penner’s big immunity scramble to save himself a few episodes back was the only playing with that level of intensity that we’ve seen on Philippines so far.

  • Game Troyzan > Post Game Troyzan for me. But I do appreciate his candor both here and on RTVZone. He’s clearly passionate about the game. I’d take him over another Colton appearance any day!

    He’s is a little obsessed with that conversation Kim had on her way to tribal council, but then again, if I were in his position, maybe I would be as well. Since he’s a football guy, I’ll use a football analogy – if you lose a game because of one blown call, you “deserved” to lose the game.

  • I’m a Brazilian guy, and I don’t think that’s a cultural problem.
    She’s a really bad player, that’s all.

  • Kajillion123

    Rob says it’s better to be the worst player that ever won the game than being the best player to never win the game, but let me tell you; no one is championing Natalie White for the Survivor Hall of Fame like they are for Rob.

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